Voters, Pledged Delegates and Super Delegates
Recently, I find my self explaining the election process and I’m amazed at how many people really don’t understand how a candidate gets the party nomination via the primaries and conventions. The democrats and the republicans have a similar process but for now we will focus on the democrats.
It shouldn’t come as a surprise, that there are areas of this process that the MSM minimizes and other areas like the primary or caucus winner that they glorify. In the world of delegate count, candidates that place first through third all get a portion of the delegates. Therefore, a winner based on percentage is not necessarily the same winner in the total delegate count. I think the MSM pundits missed these classes.
Delegates, super delegates and voters are three very distinct things in the Democratic Party nominating process. While all three are important to the process one stands out the most and can be more valuable to a candidates. Oh so you think it’s the voter, no we only play a small roll in the process. While the candidates do cherish our votes because they add to a candidates delegate count, it’s the super delegates that put a candidate over the top for the nomination. There are currently 4,049 total delegates to the Democratic National Convention; this includes 3,253 pledged delegates and 796 super delegates. The total number of delegate votes needed to win the party nomination is 2,025.
Let’s start with the basics; each state is allowed a certain number of delegates who go to the national convention and pledge their votes and support to a particular candidate. Candidates win “pledged†delegates not on whether they win a state - but on how many voters support them. So, for instance, even though Clinton and Edwards lost Iowa, they each won 16 delegates. Therefore, individual votes count towards pledge delegates.
Now about 20% of the delegates at the convention are unpledged delegates or “super delegates,†they are bread apart. First let’s look at how they came about and who they are. After the 1968 Democratic Convention, the Democratic Party called for reforms in the primary process, and formed the McGovern-Fraser Commission.
“In response to the bitter Democratic convention of 1968, the Democratic Party established the Commission on Party Structure and Delegate Selection, popularly known as the McGovern-Fraser Commission after its chairs, Senator George McGovern and Congressman Don Fraser. The Commission was created to investigate and make recommendations for the reform of primary elections within the U.S. Until now, state legislators had responsibility for selecting delegates to each party’s nominating conventions. The Commission overhauled the rules, and opened up the process of selecting delegates to public participation and voting, thereby including more women, youth and minority delegates.â€
The McGovern commission brought and end to the old boss system of choosing presidential nominees and helped create the modern presidential primary system. Party bosses no longer had control over two-thirds to four-fifths of the delegates. The bosses could no longer appoint ex-officio delegates (cronies of the bosses) to the convention.
Now, while this sounds very inclusive, open and fair it created the unpledged delegates or “super delegates†who are in fact ex-officio delegates. They are interest group representatives, and union officials; appointed by party officials and office holders. Today, about 20 percent of delegates are still “super†or ex-officio delegates.
There are 798 super delegates at the convention in Denver; they don’t have to wait until their states primary or the convention to pledge. They include all elected members of the Democratic National Committee, all current Democratic members of Congress (including non-voting delegates), all sitting Democratic governors, and past party luminaries (former presidents). Unlike pledged delegates, who are bound to particular candidates, super delegates are free to vote their consciences.
For example, when John Kerry endorsed Obama, the MSM told everyone that the endorsements only meant that Obama got Kerry’s extensive email list and that endorsements by Senators, Governors and unions mean nothing. Well, actually they do mean something; John Kerry like everyone else in Congress is a “super delegate†as are Governors, other elected officials and union officials.
According to the Democratic National Convention Delegate Rules: The procedure to be used for certifying unpledged party leader and elected official delegates is as follows:
Not later than March 1, 2008, the Secretary of the Democratic National Committee shall officially confirm to each State Democratic Chair the names of the following unpledged delegates who legally reside in their respective state and who shall be recognized as part of their state’s delegation unless any such member has publicly expressed support for the election of, or has endorsed, a presidential candidate of another political party;
So with that bit of knowledge, let’s look at the democratic candidates who have gained pledged delegates and super delegates. You will notice that Obama is ahead in the pledged delegate count (the voters) but Clinton is actually in the lead because of the super delegates and not the pledge delegates.
Delegate Count Via CNN
Clinton: Delegate Total 190 ; Pledged: 24; Superdelegates:166
Obama:Delegate Total:103;Pledged: 25; Superdelegates: 78
Edwards: Delegate Total 51;Pledged: 18;Superdelegates: 33
Delegate Count via Real Clear Politics
So there you have it, after one caucus and one primary (Michigan has no delegates), Hillary Clinton is in the lead via the delegate count, thanks to the super delegates of the party establishment. However, that’s not to say that Edwards or Obama can’t win the nomination. Both need to rack up enough pledge delegates for the super delegates to fall into place. Remember there are still 48 states left with delegates waiting to be heard. This is why John Edwards has stated that he will stay in all the way to the convention.
Sphere: Related ContentFiled under: Clinton, Edwards, Election, Obama, Politics, delegates, primary
![[image]](http://mowser.com/img?url=http%3A%2F%2Fpub.mowser.com%2Fmedia%2Fmobileweb.png)
![[image]](http://mowser.com/img?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.blogsbywomen.org%2Fchicklet.gif)
[...] nytexan wrote an interesting post today on Voters, Pledged Delegats and Super DelegatesHere’s a quick excerptBoth need to rack up enough pledge delegates for the super delegates to fall into place. Remember there are still 48 states left with delegates waiting to be heard. This is why John Edwards has stated that he will stay in all the way to … [...]
[...] at BlueBloggin explains who Voters, Pledged Delegates and Super Delegates are and how they influence the democratic party nomination at the [...]
[...] at BlueBloggin explains who Voters, Pledged Delegates and Super Delegates are and how they influence the democratic party nomination at the [...]
What does Methylsulfonylmethane (MSM), MSC Industrial Direct Co Inc (MSM), or the Morehouse School of Medicine’s (MSM) and the Medical Specialties Managers, Inc. (MSM) have to do with politics. Why don’t you spell out your acronyms for us simple folks at least once. After all you are trying to educate us.
Dumb question - suppose candidate A wins 60% of the vote in a state, and candidate B wins 40%. I suppose this means that A also gets about 60% of the delegates, while B gets around 40%.
Now - how does an individual delegate decide which person she/he supports? Does someone just apportion them? Also, I understand that a delegate is not obligated to stick with this choice… what bearing does that have on the convention?
Thanks, Matt
Anonymous:
MSM = Main Stream Media. It has become part of the lexicon that even the MSM use when referring to themselves.
Matt:
Your math for giving out the delegates is correct, however a candidate only needs 15% of the vote to qualify for delegates. This is how Richardson and Edwards got some delegates.
Now for the super d’s, you are correct they can change their mind and they are either colleagues/friends, of the candidate or the campaigns solicit the delegate. Super delegates really need to done away with.
Thanks for the additional clarity!
Yeah, thanks, NYTexan! One more thing - those non-super delegates who are “assigned,” say, to Clinton. How are they assigned? Does the DNC just say which delegates go to Clinton, and which to Obama?
So does 5 delegates mean 5 real people? or is it 5 ‘units’ as decided by a formula. I mean is a delegate a real person who votes?
Yes, it’s real people…
Thanks. So how do the delegates get selected? What do I have to do to become a (pledged) delegate?
Also, If the voters and delegates are separate things, then how do we decide which candidate wins (lets keep super delegates out for now)? What if Obama gets more delegate votes than Hillary, but Hillary gets more number of votes?
I don’t know how delegates are selected, or how they get “assigned” to a candidate. I do believe that, since number of delegates is proportional to number of votes, then the delegate results will mirror the voting results (within a certain error).
The Repubs do it differently, since some of their states are “all or none” - the winner gets every delegate from the state.
Delegates to the national convention start at the precinct level.
Texas for example:
1)After the election on March 4, the precinct chair holds a delegate selection which consists of the voters in that precinct;
2)a few weeks later those precinct delegates go to the county convention for delegate selection for the state convention;
3) At the Texas Democratic Convention those chosen county delegates get picked to go to the national convention in Denver.
WhatPolitics:
Delegates are not assigned to a candidate. At the convention all the delegates from the same state meet to discuss issues of each candidate and then they vote on the candidate that the state as a whole will support. Those are the pledged delegates
The Super Delegates do not participate in this process, they are completely separate. Super delegates are directly approached by the candidates before (during primaries) and during the convention.
Matt:
The DNC does not assign or say what delegates go to what candidate. They use the formula of percentages after each primary and caucus for the delegate distribution. Remeber a candidate must have at least 15% of the primary vote to get delegates. The only delegate assignment that the DNC has is their own and individual super delegate vote at the convention.
When do superdelegates cast their vote? Is it by secret ballot?
Al Tejeda:
Super delegates vote at the national convention in Denver. Since their vote is assigned to a candidate it is not secret.
Keep in mind that the super delegates that have announced so far, do not have to say with that candidate. They can change their mind at the convention.
Super delegates are a system that needs to be taken away.
NYT:
Thanks, so much, for all of this great info! I’m still confused, though, about the same thing. Suppose State A goes 60% Obama and 40% Clinton, and that state has 20 delegates. In principle, then, 12 are pledged to Obama, and 8 to Clinton. Now, if I’m an individual delegate, is it true that, right now, I, myself, am not pledged to anything or anyone? Then, what do the 12 and 8 mean, vis-a-vis what happens at the convention? Do the delegates say “12 beats 8, so we all go for Obama?” (I know that it’s less simple than that, because it would then just be “winner take all.”)
I also remember years ago, hearing that, although a delegate is not bound by how they are pledged, it’s frowned upon to change midstream unless there is a compelling reason. Of course, this makes no sense to me if indivuals are not pledged in the first place.
Onging thanks, Matt
Matt:
You are very welcome. I hope this thread help everyone understand how this process for the democrats works.
As I explained above, Individual delegate are chosen from the precinct level up to the state. Votes and population decide a states delegate count before a primary is held. Votes turn into pledged delegates on primary night.
As for individual voters; when we cast a vote we are adding to the percentage in the delegate column. Pledge delegates are votes that are can not be changed because they are tied to the vote you cast on election day.
Individual votes = pledged delegates
Super delegates are not held or bound to a candidate. For instance let’s say a Senator endorsed Hillary in January and then at the national convention in August that same Senator can change his super delegate vote to Obama.
Thanks once more, NYT! So, suppose I’m one of the delegates from State A. I show up to the convention. Am I, MYSELF, actually pledged to Obama or Clinton, at that point? I’m guessing no - that it’s still just a “numbers thing.” But, if so, how was it decided to whom I am pledged?
Matt i will take a stab at this, as its completely confusting to me as well and when NYT has a chance we get straightened out…if i am wrong. If you or me are chosen to be a delegate (we pay our own way to the convention) each state has a different way of choosing them (all the better for the UNdemocratic fogged process) its not a winner take all in the primaries and caucuses..thats where we are now…they the delegates get divided. Most delegates on the state level know who they want…IF they see, that the people WANT a certain candidate ie. Obama at the National Convention …..I BELIEVE and could be Wrong that is where they can change their mind…us little non super delegates..
.NOW the super delegates can also change their minds. OH yes..they are like the special chess peices that can do all sorts of tricky things..vs. your average two move pawn…that is why group like the Democratics for America are setting out petitions NOW, to ensure that super delegates doing favors for the machine DO NOT tip the election of the nominee and make sure to follow the numbers in the popular primary votes of their states at the very least. At the National Convention in August ..thats where deals are made..for example ..Edwards has delegates to give away..and we are not done yet with the super delegates..anyone who has held office can be one…hence John Glenn just dusted himself off for the clinton machine.
If i am wrong ..and if i missed something NYT will fill us in - technically though i do believe balloting is SECRET so a super delegate could theoretically CHANGE THEIR MIND in the booth right up in the last minutes.. In short the national convention is gonna be a MESS ! till the very last minutes..shades of 68 ..yep
There is no such thing as a “pledged delegate” !
Delegates vote as they damn well please !
The same thing is true of the electoral college .
The electoral college was the founding fathers’ way of securing a “proper” president and not what the hoi palloi voted!!
Dr. Roland Esquivel:
Your talking apples and oranges;
“pledged delegate†and electoral college are two entirely different processes.
your statement:
There is no such thing as a “pledged delegate†!
This is completely incorrect. Pledged delegates are primary voters and caucus goers who “pledge” their vote or voice to a particular democratic presidential candidate for the party nomination.
With that said, it’s obvious that the voters and caucus goers who “pledged” their support for their candidate at the primary and who did not get the nomination would change their vote at the general election.
The electoral college, doesn’t take place during the primary process or the general election. That actually happens on the first Monday after the second Wednesday in December.
Furthermore, some States, require electors to cast their votes according to the popular vote. These pledges fall into two categories — electors bound by State law and those bound by pledges to political parties.
I’m sixty years old and have never voted in an election. This year’s primary in my state will mark the first change to that policy in this lifetime. Things have become too critical to not at least make a hopeless effort. The point here is that I’m hardly educated on the electoral process, now am I? But in taking my first look, it appears horrifyingly (if not surprisingly) obvious that the people do not make the ultimate determinations about who represents them in government. That’s why I’ve put more than a few years into wondering “what’s the point?” I’m going to give it a shot. Maybe the first and last. In any case, God help us all and God bless America.
James Douglas:
Glad to hear that you will be voting this time around. And, you are correct things are too critical to not vote this year.
I believe, we find ourselves in the current situation because we have all lived our own bubble for a few decades. In doing this we have allowed power hungry politicians and corporations with personal agendas hijack the country.
We need to seriously turn this country around and change the world opinion of America.
Hi. I’ve been following the results of different States (only 2 to go). I particulary think that the way Americans (democrats) choose their candidate is NOT REALLY A DEMOCRATIC WAY. Democracy means “power to the people”. In this case, people may choose a candidate, let’s say 52 % of votes, and still, the other candidate who got less perentage, can win (that reminds me of Al Gore vs. George Bush). That is everything, but democracy. That’s bullshit!!! Sorry, but it’s true, either you want to admit it or not. Now I understand why most Americans don’t vote at all. What’s the point on wasting their time if, at the end, they may not have the final decision? Well, that’s up to “super delegates”. Ha ha ha, and you call that democracy?